4月18日（金）は、東京藝術大学大学院の先端芸術表現科・先端芸術表現専攻を首席卒業したばかり、近年は森美術館・東京都現代美術館などで作品を発表している美術家・市原えつこさんが登場。番組ナビゲーター・川田十夢さんともかねてから交友のある市原さんは、会社員時代から作品を制作、その後独立。さらに大学院に入学したというキャリアの持ち主。そのキャリアを通して感じてきたことを聞きました。▼目次大阪・関西万博「日本館」の方針策定に携わる「日本的な文化・習慣・信仰」を題材にテクノロジーを用いた作品を作る市原さんは、2025大阪・関西万博「日本館基本構想事業」クリエイターとしても活動。2020年に就任した「日本館基本構想事業」クリエイターとしての任務は、「本当に初期の構想として9名のクリエイターが集まって、全員で議論して、どういう方向性で日本館を作っていくかという方針策定をする」ことだそう。 大阪・関西万博の会場にも「日本館の内覧会で3月末ぐらい」に訪れたそうで、「まだ工事しているところもある状態だったんですけど、とはいえ、実は人生初万博だったんです。シンプルに、こんな面白いんだってびっくりしました」とのこと。 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日本館について、川田さんが「自分の提案した断片が残ったり、感じてましたか？」と質問すると「ほんのり匂うかなぐらいです」「国家パビリオンの割にはほんのり狂気が（ある）。マニアックなものとか死生観みたいな概念が入って、最後まで残っていたのはちょっと嬉しかったです」と市原さん。活動初期の“喘ぐ大根”市原さんが手がけた作品で初期に話題となったのが「セクハラ・インターフェース」。「太古から現代に至るまで、日本人のエロに関するクリエイティヴィティには、目を見張るものがあります」（市原えつこさん公式サイトより）と、日本の性文化に着目した、触ると大根が喘ぐというメディアアートです。 %3Ciframe%20width%3D%221280%22%20height%3D%22720%22%20src%3D%22https%3A%2F%2Fwww.youtube.com%2Fembed%2FGElYzhyzgAY%22%20frameborder%3D%220%22%20allow%3D%22accelerometer%3B%20autoplay%3B%20encrypted-media%3B%20gyroscope%3B%20picture-in-picture%22%20allowfullscreen%3E%3C%2Fiframe%3EEtsuko Ichihara / 市原えつこ セクハラ・インターフェース（喘ぐ大根） 川田さんとはその作品制作当時に会う機会があったそう。「初めてお会いしたとき、多分学生のときとか、社会人1年目とかだと思う」と市原さん。「私の作品を最初に世間に発表した場が、川田さんからお呼びいただいた『AR忘年会』」で、「めちゃくちゃ恐怖しながら」発表したそうですが「発表したらすごく楽しい」と感じたことが「作家第一歩みたいなところがある」と振り返りました。 当時の印象について川田さんは「市原さんがそういう（アートの）世界に向いてるなと思ったのは、普通（アーティストが）コンセプトを話すのって、技術者が説明書を解説してるような野暮ったいことになりがちなんだけど、市原さんは、自分の作品を説明してるその光景自体がもう面白い。やっぱりそういう人は向いてるなと思って」「コンテンポラリーな、性的な作品を作る人がマイクを持って説明してもちゃんとウケるって結構難しいんだけど、市原さんは最初からやってたよ」と語ります。独立の意外なきっかけ「IT企業で5年働いて、働いている最中に（前述の）大根の作品で徐々にいろんなメディアに呼ばれるようになり、でも会社辞めたくないから、ずっと二足のわらじ。作品をコソコソ、昼休みとか週末とかに作りながら会社勤めをしていた」という市原さん。「（勤務していた会社では）、なるべくこのままでと思い、あくまで作品は趣味としてやっていた」といいます。 「そんな中、分岐点があったんですか？」と川田さんが聞くと、「変な話なんですけど、たまたま出会った占い師に独立しようかちょっと迷ってるんですよね、みたいな話をしたら、『早く（会社を）出ないと多分足を折ると思います。』って言われて、その2ヶ月後に上司との面談前に階段で足を折ったんです」と市原さん。それを機に「1週間後に『会社辞めます』って上司に言った」という市原さん。「（会社員時代は）やっぱり時間的な制約はどうしてもあるのと、自分の作品が物議を醸しやすいので、名前が漏れて、万が一（勤務先の）株価がどうのこうのとなったら、自分だけの問題じゃ済まないので。個人のクリエイターが好き放題やったことが株価に響くとちょっと…というのは個人的にヒヤヒヤしていたので、それがなくなったからもう何でもできる気持ちにはなりましたね」と独立時の心境を語ります。「30年・40年やるんだったら、2年ぐらい勉強してもいい」独立後も作品作りを続ける中、川田さんは、市原さんの大学院進学について「なんでそういうアカデミックの方向に行ったのかなってちょっと不思議だったんです」と質問。 「美術教育を元々受けたかったが、高校生のときはアーティストがどのように食べていくか分からず、そこにフルベットできない」と考え一般大学へ進学したという市原さん。「とはいえいろいろ仕事（作品作り）を重ねる中で、これはなんだかんだ一生やる仕事になるなってだんだん途中から覚悟が決まってきて、あと30年とか40年（美術を）やるんだったら1回、2年ぐらい勉強してもいいんじゃないかなと思って」大学院に「30代だけど、入ってもいい」と思ったそう。 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そして先端芸術表現科・先端芸術表現専攻を首席卒業した市原さんですが、その今後について「本当に無双。ただでさえ自由だったけど、さらにアカデミアの首席も取っちゃって、どこへ向かうんでしょうか」と川田さん。 すると市原さんは「大学院入る前に、規模感が大きい仕事と自分の変態性の両立が難しいなって思っていて。規模がでかいとその（仕事の）モジュールとして徹してしまうし、自分の狂気をぶちこむものはなるべくちっちゃく、みたいに分かれていたんですけど、それを“変態の聖地”である藝大で純粋培養をすることでどれだけ広めても薄まらない濃い原液を2年間で作ったみたいなところがあったので、その原液をこれからいろんな形で社会に還元していこうと目指しています」と明かしました。今年3月には展覧会「ディストピア・ランド」を開催するなど、市原さんの表現の要素の一つとなるのが「ディストピア」。その展覧会では「最悪な時代に、人はどのようにしぶとく生きられるのか？」と掲げており、市原さんは「闇のサイドを切り開くことで、明るい方に未来が行ってもいいし、闇の方に行ってもどうにかしぶとく生きていけるぞという気持ちを高めたい」と、ディストピアを題材にしている理由を語ります。「ディストピアまだまだやるぞという気持ちがあるので、テーマパーク化を狙っていきたい。ディズニーに負けないものを」と今後の構想を話す市川さんに、「いいですね。そういう時はテクノロジーが必要だから、そこで合流しようか」と川田さんも応えました。%3Cblockquote%20class%3D%22instagram-media%22%20data-instgrm-permalink%3D%22https%3A%2F%2Fwww.instagram.com%2Fp%2FDHYY-OCyuky%2F%22%20data-instgrm-version%3D%2212%22%20style%3D%22%20background%3A%23FFF%3B%20border%3A0%3B%20border-radius%3A3px%3B%20box-shadow%3A0%200%201px%200%20rgba(0%2C0%2C0%2C0.5)%2C0%201px%2010px%200%20rgba(0%2C0%2C0%2C0.15)%3B%20margin%3A%201px%3B%20max-width%3A540px%3B%20min-width%3A326px%3B%20padding%3A0%3B%20width%3A99.375%25%3B%20width%3A-webkit-calc(100%25%20-%202px)%3B%20width%3Acalc(100%25%20-%202px)%3B%22%3E%3Cdiv%20style%3D%22padding%3A16px%3B%22%3E%20%3Ca%20href%3D%22https%3A%2F%2Fwww.instagram.com%2Fp%2FDHYY-OCyuky%2F%22%20style%3D%22%20background%3A%23FFFFFF%3B%20line-height%3A0%3B%20padding%3A0%200%3B%20text-align%3Acenter%3B%20text-decoration%3Anone%3B%20width%3A100%25%3B%22%20target%3D%22_blank%22%3E%20%3Cdiv%20style%3D%22%20display%3A%20flex%3B%20flex-direction%3A%20row%3B%20align-items%3A%20center%3B%22%3E%20%3Cdiv%20style%3D%22background-color%3A%20%23F4F4F4%3B%20border-radius%3A%2050%25%3B%20flex-grow%3A%200%3B%20height%3A%2040px%3B%20margin-right%3A%2014px%3B%20width%3A%2040px%3B%22%3E%3C%2Fdiv%3E%20%3Cdiv%20style%3D%22display%3A%20flex%3B%20flex-direction%3A%20column%3B%20flex-grow%3A%201%3B%20justify-content%3A%20center%3B%22%3E%20%3Cdiv%20style%3D%22%20background-color%3A%20%23F4F4F4%3B%20border-radius%3A%204px%3B%20flex-grow%3A%200%3B%20height%3A%2014px%3B%20margin-bottom%3A%206px%3B%20width%3A%20100px%3B%22%3E%3C%2Fdiv%3E%20%3Cdiv%20style%3D%22%20background-color%3A%20%23F4F4F4%3B%20border-radius%3A%204px%3B%20flex-grow%3A%200%3B%20height%3A%2014px%3B%20width%3A%2060px%3B%22%3E%3C%2Fdiv%3E%3C%2Fdiv%3E%3C%2Fdiv%3E%3Cdiv%20style%3D%22padding%3A%2019%25%200%3B%22%3E%3C%2Fdiv%3E%20%3Cdiv%20style%3D%22display%3Ablock%3B%20height%3A50px%3B%20margin%3A0%20auto%2012px%3B%20width%3A50px%3B%22%3E%3Csvg%20width%3D%2250px%22%20height%3D%2250px%22%20viewBox%3D%220%200%2060%2060%22%20version%3D%221.1%22%20xmlns%3D%22https%3A%2F%2Fwww.w3.org%2F2000%2Fsvg%22%20xmlns%3Axlink%3D%22https%3A%2F%2Fwww.w3.org%2F1999%2Fxlink%22%3E%3Cg%20stroke%3D%22none%22%20stroke-width%3D%221%22%20fill%3D%22none%22%20fill-rule%3D%22evenodd%22%3E%3Cg%20transform%3D%22translate(-511.000000%2C%20-20.000000)%22%20fill%3D%22%23000000%22%3E%3Cg%3E%3Cpath%20d%3D%22M556.869%2C30.41%20C554.814%2C30.41%20553.148%2C32.076%20553.148%2C34.131%20C553.148%2C36.186%20554.814%2C37.852%20556.869%2C37.852%20C558.924%2C37.852%20560.59%2C36.186%20560.59%2C34.131%20C560.59%2C32.076%20558.924%2C30.41%20556.869%2C30.41%20M541%2C60.657%20C535.114%2C60.657%20530.342%2C55.887%20530.342%2C50%20C530.342%2C44.114%20535.114%2C39.342%20541%2C39.342%20C546.887%2C39.342%20551.658%2C44.114%20551.658%2C50%20C551.658%2C55.887%20546.887%2C60.657%20541%2C60.657%20M541%2C33.886%20C532.1%2C33.886%20524.886%2C41.1%20524.886%2C50%20C524.886%2C58.899%20532.1%2C66.113%20541%2C66.113%20C549.9%2C66.113%20557.115%2C58.899%20557.115%2C50%20C557.115%2C41.1%20549.9%2C33.886%20541%2C33.886%20M565.378%2C62.101%20C565.244%2C65.022%20564.756%2C66.606%20564.346%2C67.663%20C563.803%2C69.06%20563.154%2C70.057%20562.106%2C71.106%20C561.058%2C72.155%20560.06%2C72.803%20558.662%2C73.347%20C557.607%2C73.757%20556.021%2C74.244%20553.102%2C74.378%20C549.944%2C74.521%20548.997%2C74.552%20541%2C74.552%20C533.003%2C74.552%20532.056%2C74.521%20528.898%2C74.378%20C525.979%2C74.244%20524.393%2C73.757%20523.338%2C73.347%20C521.94%2C72.803%20520.942%2C72.155%20519.894%2C71.106%20C518.846%2C70.057%20518.197%2C69.06%20517.654%2C67.663%20C517.244%2C66.606%20516.755%2C65.022%20516.623%2C62.101%20C516.479%2C58.943%20516.448%2C57.996%20516.448%2C50%20C516.448%2C42.003%20516.479%2C41.056%20516.623%2C37.899%20C516.755%2C34.978%20517.244%2C33.391%20517.654%2C32.338%20C518.197%2C30.938%20518.846%2C29.942%20519.894%2C28.894%20C520.942%2C27.846%20521.94%2C27.196%20523.338%2C26.654%20C524.393%2C26.244%20525.979%2C25.756%20528.898%2C25.623%20C532.057%2C25.479%20533.004%2C25.448%20541%2C25.448%20C548.997%2C25.448%20549.943%2C25.479%20553.102%2C25.623%20C556.021%2C25.756%20557.607%2C26.244%20558.662%2C26.654%20C560.06%2C27.196%20561.058%2C27.846%20562.106%2C28.894%20C563.154%2C29.942%20563.803%2C30.938%20564.346%2C32.338%20C564.756%2C33.391%20565.244%2C34.978%20565.378%2C37.899%20C565.522%2C41.056%20565.552%2C42.003%20565.552%2C50%20C565.552%2C57.996%20565.522%2C58.943%20565.378%2C62.101%20M570.82%2C37.631%20C570.674%2C34.438%20570.167%2C32.258%20569.425%2C30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2%20font-family%3AArial%2Csans-serif%3B%20font-size%3A14px%3B%20line-height%3A17px%3B%22%20datetime%3D%222020-03-27T00%3A48%3A59%2B00%3A00%22%3E%3C%2Ftime%3E%3C%2Fp%3E%3C%2Fdiv%3E%3C%2Fblockquote%3E%20%3Cscript%20async%20src%3D%22%2F%2Fwww.instagram.com%2Fembed.js%22%3E%3C%2Fscript%3E自身を切り取った一言は「変態紳士」「Morisawa Fonts ROAD TO INNOVATION」では、ゲストに「自分自身の考えを自ら切り取る言葉」を訊ね、その言葉を、ゲストお気に入りのフォントとともに紹介しています。市原さんが自身を切り取った言葉は「変態紳士」。選んだフォントは「秀英初号明朝」です。「（大学院での）トレーニングを終えたところなので、変態紳士として、今後は生きていきたいと思っております」とその言葉の意図を解説し、選んだフォント「秀英初号明朝」については「非常に高級感のあるフォント。この和食の料亭のようなフォントでビシッと彩りたい」と語りました。PODCAST | 川田十夢×市原えつこ本記事の放送回をディレクターズカットでお聴きいただけます。%3Ciframe%20src%3D%22https%3A%2F%2Fplayer.sonicbowl.cloud%2Fpodcast%2Fa3a3aca0-193d-494b-b446-e4f3b7adecea%2F%22%20allow%3D%22autoplay%3B%20clipboard-write%3B%20encrypted-media%3B%20fullscreen%3B%20picture-in-picture%22%20height%3D%22240%22%20width%3D%22100%25%22%20style%3D%22border%3A0%22%3E%3C%2Fiframe%3E